The Other Kind of Privacy- Property Postings

Although there are many reasons people move from the city to the country, some of the most common include the desire for a little elbow room and some privacy. I am always surprised when I found out what my real estate clients mean when I ask them to define both. When I lived in Manhattan “elbow room” was measured in small amounts of square feet and the difference between a large apartment and a small one could be as little as 100 square feet (just 10’ by 10’), and if you wanted privacy, forget about it. There is no such thing. The solution for some of us was to purchase a second home upstate. 

I lucked out. The short story was that in 1985 I had two kids, a 3 and 5 year old who both needed to go to school in Manhattan. At least at that time this meant private school. With limited resources we went with a school in the village, Little Red on Sixth Avenue. No Dalton, but safe and reasonable. I used to call it “10 fingers and 10 toes.” (This meant I was relatively sure my kids would come home with the same amount of digits they left our loft with in the morning.) It costs $10,000 per kid per year back then. I have no idea what that would cost today. The bottom line was that we had purchased a vacation home with relatives upstate and while writing the check for the 1985-86 school year we decided we needed a big change. We bought out the other relatives (partners) and decided to go “Green Acres,”  and in 1986 we sold our loft and moved permanently to East Durham, New York. 

As I said, we lucked out. Our new home was at the end of a dead end road. It is 98 acres with two streams, a 1 acre pond and fully treed. Once we thinned some of our south facing trees we got awesome views of the mountains. Better yet we were surrounded by other large parcels so we have unbelievable privacy. Always looking ahead I started to research the best ways to reduce our taxes, knowing that this was going to be our biggest growing budget number. I didn't want to deal with ever increasing property taxes so I found out about Section 480-a of the tax code which allows for a large tax abatement if the landowner complied with an approved NYS forestry plan. New York State allows such a plan on parcels with 50 or more acres of wooded property. I’m saving a full explanation of this plan for a future post but if you are interested just follow this LINK and read about the process. 

1. You must own or have land use rights on the property to be posted.
2. Signs must bear the name and address of the owner, lawful occupant or other person or organization authorized to post the area. The first names can be only initials (so mine simply say H&C Zucker) and the address need only be the town, not actual street address (so mine simply says East Durham, NY. My post office address is actually a different town, Cairo, but because the property is actually in East Durham my signs must say East Durham, not Cairo.)
3. The sign must be at least 11” by 11” and the written part must take up at least 9” by 9” or 80% of the sign.
4. The sign must bear a conspicuous statement which shall either consist of the word "POSTED" or warn against entry for specified purposes or all purposeswithout the consent of the person whose name appears on the sign.
5. At least one sign must be set on each side of the protected area and on each side of all corners that can be reasonably identified. Signs should be no more than 660 feet apart, close to or along the boundaries of the protected area. Since the signs must be conspicuous, they should be high enough, and spaced closely enough to be seen. Please don't turn your property into an eyesore by using more signs than are necessary, although I do recommend that on street boundaries where the most trespassers may come from I shrink the distance and put signs every 200 to 300 feet.
6. Signs must be maintained annually by the landowner.

One of the requirements for this tax reduction plan involves the marking and posting of your property. Marking is easy. This means you would pick a symbol, mine are two horizontal blue lines, and paint the symbol on boundary trees. The posting requirement is a bit more involved. Whether you are posting for NYS Forestry reasons or just to keep others off your property, the requirements are the same. Below are the important steps and requirements for proper posting in New York State:
There are a few other things that might be helpful. The first is that you have no obligation to post. Anyone who trespasses is still legally a trespasser  The property does not have to be posted to prosecute the offender, but it is much more likely that a judge will prosecute the offender if the property is properly posted. You may also post only a portion of your property. You can include language on the signs that require permission for entry. This serves multiple purposes. By giving permission to some people for some activities you will be in a better position if any adverse possession issues come up. It also lets the public know that if asked, permission might be granted. 

One of the funniest things that has ever happened to me, and says something about the times we live in took place a few years ago. As I said, my property is very large with multiple streams. One of those streams has a series of waterfalls, one of which has over a 50 foot drop and is very dramatic. In the winter it is simply beautiful. One day a brand new Land Cruiser pulled up to my front door and a handsome, well dressed man got out and introduced himself as “almost” a neighbor. By “almost” he meant that his property bordered a parcel that bordered my property. After the introduction he asked me what I still consider to be the stupidest question I ever heard. “My wife and I love your property and walk it all the time. Can we buy your waterfall?” 

At first I thought that he was kidding, but he wasn't  Once I realized that he actually meant it, I told him “NO” and reminded him that he was trespassing and should ask permission if he ever wanted to enter it again. While this may seem like an un-neighborly thing to do, it wasn't  It was simply protective. Whether the property is posted or not, the General Obligations Law protects landowners from liability for non-paying recreationalists on their property. Because of this protection, recreational liability lawsuits against rural landowners are uncommon, however this protection does not apply in cases of willful or malicious failure to guard or warn against dangers. The problem with this is that “willful or malicious failure to guard or warn against dangers” is not specific and is interpretable. A rope or dropped tree across a path on the property could be a viewed as a danger and as we have become a very litigious people, not something a landowner should take jokingly. Remember, some crazy woman successfully sued McDonald's for a scalding she claimed she got from a cup of hot coffee. I’d take no chances. Murphy’s Law is real and the best way to protect yourself is to protect your property rights. I will always give neighbors the right to walk my property, but do expect a call for permission. It would be best for you to protect yourself as well. Click here to download the "Ask Permission Slip" (26kb pdf).